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Karmanos saves money if NHL doesn't play
'Canes owner ready for extended lockout
September 22, 2004
BY NICHOLAS J. COTSONIKA
FREE PRESS SPORTS WRITER
Peter Karmanos had some strong words for the NHL Players' Association on Tuesday.
"The losses are going to stop," said Karmanos, the Detroit businessman who owns the Carolina Hurricanes. "We're going to tie players' salaries to the revenues of the league, and they can sit and be petulant and pout about it all they want. They can negotiate a deal to make them partners.
"We're talking about a union that's done a very good job for its players, but way past the point of no return in terms of greed."
Red Wings owner Mike Ilitch declined to be interviewed about the NHL lockout. But Karmanos had no such reservations at media day for the Plymouth Whalers, his Ontario Hockey League team.
Asked if the owners were willing to sit out the entire season to get their way -- with the players saying they will never accept a salary cap -- Karmanos said, "We lose half as much money by not playing. What do you think?"
Karmanos said he has lost an average of $12 million to $16 million a year since he bought his NHL franchise in 1994, then he brought up his Karmanos Cancer Institute.
"Where do you think I'd rather have seen the money go?" he said.
He said he would lose $5 million if the 'Canes didn't play this season.
Asked if the NHL would operate next season, he said, "Time will tell. We'll lose less money next year as well. It's like a panacea to me. I suddenly have an extra seven, eight million dollars."
Karmanos said the NHL could set an example.
"All of sports has a problem, and the problem is, the players' salaries are out of control," he said. "Something has to change, and fortunately we have a chance to do it first in hockey. We get the right kind of deal in hockey, you will watch every other professional league fall in line, because they all have financial problems, including the NFL."
Karmanos called the players' average salary of $1.8 million "ridiculous."
NHLPA senior director Ted Saskin responded: "It is absurd to suggest the players have been greedy. It is the owners who set players' salaries as they determine in a market-based system."
Karmanos said the owners had created the situation, but they were also under pressure to spend.
"They're not there to make their living off of hockey," he said. "They're there because they love the sport and they love to compete, and it's that very love of competition that's gotten us into trouble.
"Every time you have a star player threatening to leave, everybody in the media and all the fans are screaming that you don't care about winning if you don't sign the guy.
"So it's not really a free-market system. Teams are forced into a situation where it isn't financially capable for them to keep going."
Saskin said the way to fix the problem was for the owners to set budgets and follow them. But Karmanos said the owners' proposal was "absolutely" the only solution.
Asked about a luxury tax, which the players have proposed as a compromise, he said, "A luxury tax doesn't work. ... A luxury tax is inflationary by its nature."
Karmanos called NHLPA executive director Bob Goodenow a "master of the smokescreen."
The league claims it has lost $1.8 billion over the last decade. The union says the league has been misleading about its finances and has challenged it to release team-by-team reports to the public.
Asked about the distrust, Karmanos said, "That's the union's mantra. ... It's a bunch of crap. ... The fact of the matter is, if the numbers for the NHL were wrong, the union would offer what their numbers were. In fact, you've never seen them even come close to that. The numbers are right. Everybody knows the numbers are right. The union wants status quo, and we can't accept status quo."
Karmanos pointed out that the owners' proposal would reduce the average NHL salary to $1.3 million.
"We're not talking about making them paupers," he said. "I think you can get by on that. We're not talking about screwing these guys. We're not talking about getting them to play for nothing and making all the money. We're trying to get the cost reasonable."
Told that some ask why the owners are in the business if it's so bad, Karmanos said, "That's what we've all said to ourselves, 'We're not staying in the business when things are so bad.' Those arguments again are smokescreen arguments. They make no sense, right?
"It's like, 'Na, na, na, na, na. You lost a lot of money. Why are you even doing this?' And then when we say, 'We're going to fix it,' (they respond), 'Well, what were you guys doing? Why were you paying it to begin with?'
"Of course it's really bad. Of course we need to do something about it. That's why we're probably not going to play any hockey this year."
Contact NICHOLAS J. COTSONIKA at 313-222-8831 or
'Canes owner ready for extended lockout
September 22, 2004
BY NICHOLAS J. COTSONIKA
FREE PRESS SPORTS WRITER
Peter Karmanos had some strong words for the NHL Players' Association on Tuesday.
"The losses are going to stop," said Karmanos, the Detroit businessman who owns the Carolina Hurricanes. "We're going to tie players' salaries to the revenues of the league, and they can sit and be petulant and pout about it all they want. They can negotiate a deal to make them partners.
"We're talking about a union that's done a very good job for its players, but way past the point of no return in terms of greed."
Red Wings owner Mike Ilitch declined to be interviewed about the NHL lockout. But Karmanos had no such reservations at media day for the Plymouth Whalers, his Ontario Hockey League team.
Asked if the owners were willing to sit out the entire season to get their way -- with the players saying they will never accept a salary cap -- Karmanos said, "We lose half as much money by not playing. What do you think?"
Karmanos said he has lost an average of $12 million to $16 million a year since he bought his NHL franchise in 1994, then he brought up his Karmanos Cancer Institute.
"Where do you think I'd rather have seen the money go?" he said.
He said he would lose $5 million if the 'Canes didn't play this season.
Asked if the NHL would operate next season, he said, "Time will tell. We'll lose less money next year as well. It's like a panacea to me. I suddenly have an extra seven, eight million dollars."
Karmanos said the NHL could set an example.
"All of sports has a problem, and the problem is, the players' salaries are out of control," he said. "Something has to change, and fortunately we have a chance to do it first in hockey. We get the right kind of deal in hockey, you will watch every other professional league fall in line, because they all have financial problems, including the NFL."
Karmanos called the players' average salary of $1.8 million "ridiculous."
NHLPA senior director Ted Saskin responded: "It is absurd to suggest the players have been greedy. It is the owners who set players' salaries as they determine in a market-based system."
Karmanos said the owners had created the situation, but they were also under pressure to spend.
"They're not there to make their living off of hockey," he said. "They're there because they love the sport and they love to compete, and it's that very love of competition that's gotten us into trouble.
"Every time you have a star player threatening to leave, everybody in the media and all the fans are screaming that you don't care about winning if you don't sign the guy.
"So it's not really a free-market system. Teams are forced into a situation where it isn't financially capable for them to keep going."
Saskin said the way to fix the problem was for the owners to set budgets and follow them. But Karmanos said the owners' proposal was "absolutely" the only solution.
Asked about a luxury tax, which the players have proposed as a compromise, he said, "A luxury tax doesn't work. ... A luxury tax is inflationary by its nature."
Karmanos called NHLPA executive director Bob Goodenow a "master of the smokescreen."
The league claims it has lost $1.8 billion over the last decade. The union says the league has been misleading about its finances and has challenged it to release team-by-team reports to the public.
Asked about the distrust, Karmanos said, "That's the union's mantra. ... It's a bunch of crap. ... The fact of the matter is, if the numbers for the NHL were wrong, the union would offer what their numbers were. In fact, you've never seen them even come close to that. The numbers are right. Everybody knows the numbers are right. The union wants status quo, and we can't accept status quo."
Karmanos pointed out that the owners' proposal would reduce the average NHL salary to $1.3 million.
"We're not talking about making them paupers," he said. "I think you can get by on that. We're not talking about screwing these guys. We're not talking about getting them to play for nothing and making all the money. We're trying to get the cost reasonable."
Told that some ask why the owners are in the business if it's so bad, Karmanos said, "That's what we've all said to ourselves, 'We're not staying in the business when things are so bad.' Those arguments again are smokescreen arguments. They make no sense, right?
"It's like, 'Na, na, na, na, na. You lost a lot of money. Why are you even doing this?' And then when we say, 'We're going to fix it,' (they respond), 'Well, what were you guys doing? Why were you paying it to begin with?'
"Of course it's really bad. Of course we need to do something about it. That's why we're probably not going to play any hockey this year."
Contact NICHOLAS J. COTSONIKA at 313-222-8831 or
