Thomas Davis

Magnus, we need a ruling on this one. Check the tape, and let me know if that was man, or Cover 2. Because if that was cover two, it was the most fucktarded cover 2 ever run.

 

It's largely irrelevant. In either case Davis was clearly responsible for the deep half (which I'm glad you've admitted you were wrong about), and he simply didn't get over to Jenkins.

Uh ... no. McCree had the other deep half, which is where you can see him end up (on Roddy White). Ciurciu and Tufts matching up suggests that you may be correct about it being man, although it's not clear, but the point is that you were wrong about Davis not having a deep half. He did, and he didn't get even close to Jenkins despite the slow development of the play and the fact that Jenkins had stopped along the sideline.

 

If you are assigned a deep half, you are to maintain your position in that deep half zone. That is the purpose of a zone, to protect a portion of the field.

McCree ended up well inside Davis' deep half. I was always taught that if two safeties were assigned to cover the deep halves, you are responsible for the 27 yards between your sideline and the middle of the field. McCree was 5-7 yards past Davis' outside hash as the play concluded. Like I said, it's my understanding that safeties, in deep half coverage, are to play their 27 yard half. McCree was a good 12-15 yards into his opposite half.

FB Griffith delayed on his release. MLB Tufts mirrored him, then immediately picked up the FB in the flat, while Ciurciu immediately ran up with WR Finneran, and outside with WR Finneran. LB Short's responsibility was HB Duckett. Duckett stayed in protection, so LB Short dropped into a deep middle zone.

Pretty confident that it was man coverage you saw. I don't know of any cover two variations that send two of three LB's into man coverage, a corner playing close to 20 yards up the field.

 

In man coverage, on a 25-yard out, it makes it hard on a safety if the corner abandons his assigned man.

In Cover 2, Davis would have received help on that play, as LB Ciurciu would have dropped into an outside zone, undercutting the intended receiver, compromising the QB's confidence in making the throw, if nothing else. Moreover, the primary responsibility of the SS/FS in cover two is patrolling over the top. He does have perimeter responsibility as well, but without an OLB undercutting the out, it is nearly impossible for Davis to make a play on that ball, without compromising the "over the top" area of the field, which in this case would have represented the 20-25 yards behind the spot of the completion.

 

What on earth are you talking about? McCree lined up outside of the left hash, in line with Davis on the opposite side wide of the right hash. You can see McCree picking up Roddy White on the left side of the field, then coming over to the right side of the field when Schaub scrambles to that side. He's not even across the right hash until after Schaub throws the ball downfield to Jenkins.

It could be man, but as I noted, that's completely irrelavent to the discussion as Davis' responsibility was clearly a deep half. You were wrong about that, and that's the only part relevant to the discussion. But as for Tufts, the play starts on the left hash and yet Griffith gets all the way out to the 0 of the "50" in the flat before Tufts even enters the television picture. His reaction suggests that you could be correct about it being man, but the slowness of his reaction also suggests that you might not. It's hard to say given that we were playing a base 4-3 against a 3 WR offensive formation.


I don't know why you're even arguing this anymore. I guess you're trying to save face regarding the ridiculous suggestion that Davis was playing a cover 1, but just give it up.

 

Jesus Christ. Please learn something about football before posting anymore, especially if you insist on pretending like you know something. Whether it was cover two zone or man with a two deep shell, in either case Davis' responsibility is to pick up the receiver over the top who is entering his area. Jenkins was that receiver. Davis did not react to or come toward Jenkins until after the pass was thrown, even though there were no other receivers entering his zone. On such a route (and it was a deep comeback, not a deep out), the safety has to come help on the receiver over the top, while someone generally has the receiver underneath, except in situations where there is a receiver running a route underneath the deep receiver (if it's zone, which it may not have been). That's the whole point of the offense running someone underneath. You either pull the inside man off of the deep receiver or have the underneath receiver matched-up on a linebacker.

So basically, because of Schaub's scramble I don't know whether it was cover two zone or cover two man, but the safeties definitely had deep halves and Davis definitely didn't get to his responsibility.

 

No man. I already corrected myself on the cover 1 deal. The tape certainly would suggest that both safties are playing the deep halves, although it looks like McCree was man-up on White at the end of the play.

It's my understanding that no matter what occurs on the play, a deep half safety stays in his deep half. That's why I was surprised to see McCree well into Davis' deep half. Regardless of where the receiver on McCree's half runs, I'm thinking it's his responsibility to continue to patrol his half, or at least avoid running 15 yards into the other safety's half.

 

Jeez bud. Just talking football here. Sorry if it hit a nerve, as I am new here.

It is impossible to tell whether it was a deep out or a deep curl. Completely impossible.

May not know as much football as some here, but I know man when I see it. And that was man, with a sub-standard corner abandoning his assignment.

And that's my final word in this thread. Good day.

 

Sorry, I overreacted, but you are really annoying me with your persistent inability to understand what I think are pretty simple points. But you do know something about football, which is more than I can say for most posters, so try and ignore my callousness to some degree and just try to be more open-minded about the things you don't know.

Not at all. You can easily tell the difference because of Jenkins' release at the line. He was already lined up outside the numbers at the snap, then took an outside release. Jenkins wouldn't even have room to run an out route when he's already that close to the sideline. Therefore it was either a streak and he broke it off when he saw Schaub scrambling or else it was a designed deep comeback.


And regarding McCree on White, if the deep safety on the other side already has someone in his zone and your man is trailing in that direction, you go with him unless there is another WR who may enter your zone. In this case there wasn't, although that's still irrelevant because McCree didn't enter Davis' half until after Schaub started scrambling, and was barely inside it at the time of the throw.

 

its a little hard to believe mcree was in the right position, but ok (just trying to add a little humor)